SOAK will be my very first event. We have a tent, but are not a part of a group and don't have a theme. Can we just set up our tent wherever we want? We'll probably be arriving around 7pm on Friday. Just don't want to invade a space we shouldn't be in.

Appreciate any info. you can share.

It's like Burning man, Some places are reserved for theme camps, other places are "open camping" for anyone. I'm sure someone will have a map at the gate to show you where *not* to camp.

But unlike Burning Man, you can't park your car next to your tent. There is a parking area for cars, then walk your tent/gear in...

I wouldn't worry about "...invade a space" If you're still unclear where to pitch your tent, just ask others in the area... I'm sure you'll be fine.

Welcome to SOAK©!!!!

The man burns in 7 days

I probably agree with what was most mentioned above. However, if Burning Man, Soakers, or just people in general want to show the love, and they base their reputation(s) off of that- then... some of us (if not all of us) should base interactions on first impressions.

Even though I have been to Burning Man in 2001, when my friend and I arrived and we started to camp in an area that had a orange ribbon around the trees (as we just thought it was a mild decoration) that said "Danger" (Ghetto camp)... we were immediately approached with the words "Get off my land".

There was no... "Hi, welcome to SOAK. In case you're thinking of camping here, this is a registered theme camp area, so you'll have to camp outside the ribboned area."

There is a polite way to approach people and there is a bad way. Obviously- this was the "elitist / bad" way of approaching people who already know how to be a part of a community and those who have helped out to make our scenes better than they were.

Secondly, even the next day (Saturday) my friend and I were not even talking to anyone in the camp, and another girl said something like- "I told you before- don't be on our land". My friend and I just laughed our asses off because we weren't even on "their" land, not in their theme camp, and we weren't even talking to her.

Despite the shallow, burner attitude that we saw from most as well as hearing the terrible House music that was played most of the time, there was at least one area that did play Shpongle and there were also OTHER nice Burners that we did meet and we hope to explore our friendship more with those POSITIVE Burners and those that have good energy. Although we are not judgmental, it appears that anyone's perception would have been just like ours due to the immediate unwelcoming that we received when we arrived. At the end of the weekend, we thought that we should have been paid for attending. Good grief.

Perhaps next year there will be a lot more of open minds, open hearts, open souls, and blessed interactions with those that have the warm aura about them (instead of those who appear that they haven't had a man give them some loving in a long time).

No disrespect, but the truth has now been thrown out and I do not mean to start a "flame war" of any kind. It just hurt our feelings and we were disrespected in more ways than one.

We also thought about the scenario that "Burners don't like PsyTrancers". I do enjoy PsyTrance but, preferably Goa, but I don't know if that statement is fully true- because one cannot say "all" in the beginning of that.

I strongly suggest booking some of our BEST DJs up here in our scene... Gorilla Dust for sure... perhaps Osiris (a friend and well-known DJ, producer, etc.) from Seattle, or having at least a SET or TWO of PsyTrance and/or Goa at a stage (if not the whole stage).

It's all good though... no worries as we brushed it off because of the shallowness, but it had to be known. An apology is in store, but we're not demanding one from anyone. We are looking on the "good side" of what we left with and are not going to focus on what happened. Perhaps though, the camp leaders should know about this so that they can correct their actions on how they approach visitors that come to their camp by mistake or even when they are just wanting to visit them.

Best of luck with future events.

This is a Burning Man event not a utopia. It is that simple. Respect different people and their right to be here but they don't have to pretend to like you. Not everyone is touchy feely and believes love is the answer. They have the right to have fun too, even if it means heckling the guy who tries to camp in an area clearly roped off for a reason.

As for music, if you want it bring it. You want more of something bring it. Your choice to call one music crap is opening a door for someone to crap on the music you love. This event is built by people doing and bringing what they love to share. This event is not about telling other people how to do it better for your enjoyment.


And of course when you pull into the DPW Ghetto expect to get heckled. I am guessing you are fortunate that you didn't get empty beer cans thrown at you.

Do your homework and please stop expecting that people must do things to please you.

And Welcome to Fucking Soak.

*HUGS*

Jason wrote:
"This is a Burning Man event not a utopia."

That has been understood a long time ago, but some just don't get it. I agree with you.

Jason also wrote:
"It is that simple. Respect different people and their right to be here but they don't have to pretend to like you."

I already do (and did when I was there) and just know that I don't have to pretend to like them either... and that was said rather loudly to make sure that the disrespect did occur.

Jason also wrote:
"Not everyone is touchy feely and believes love is the answer."

Not everyone is self-centered, superficial and standoffish and believe that lashing out at guests is the way to welcome anyone.

Jason also wrote:
"They have the right to have fun too, even if it means heckling the guy who tries to camp in an area clearly roped off for a reason."

Yeah- this could have been done after the greetings and a joke could have been made of it. That camp obviously had the wrong approach that's for sure.

Jason also wrote:
"As for music, if you want it bring it."

Great! Next time I'll blast it then (or, have it played).

Jason also wrote:
"You want more of something bring it."

Great... I'll do that then next year.

Jason also wrote:
"Your choice to call one music crap is opening a door for someone to crap on the music you love."

That's understandable and frankly- I don't give a rat's a--. "Rap is Crap" also and I'm going to get a black t-shirt which huge lettering saying something to that effect. We all have our likes and dislikes. I'm just not afraid to keep my hidden, and I do tell it like it is (everything).

Jason also wrote:
"This event is built by people doing and bringing what they love to share."

Yes- like the Phoenix Festivals. Let's invite everyone and instead of having 18 camps, we'll have 2,293 camps with everyone doing what they want to do in their sacred space/comfort zone. Ridiculous to me, but hey- you suggested it like many of us have before.

Jason also wrote:
"This event is not about telling other people how to do it better for your enjoyment."

After reading my first post- never did I once mention how others could "do it better". Perhaps that's an subliminal message that people already know that they need to improve it. It's going to happen anyways- because every year should get better, don't you think? I only suggested booking a PsyTrance DJ or whatever, but since you said to "bring it"... that's what we'll do then next year.

Jason also wrote:
"And of course when you pull into the DPW Ghetto expect to get heckled. I am guessing you are fortunate that you didn't get empty beer cans thrown at you. "

They're fortunate that the beer cans and flaming pine cones didn't get thrown back at them as well. Some of us who appear "small" in one's eyes are actually like a Palestinian mustard seed... it becomes much larger and stronger than anyone would ever believe (like something else some of us know). Don't expect nothing will happen if first force is thrown at someone else.

Jason also wrote:
"Do your homework"

Go to Gathering of the Tribes (GOTT), and maybe I'll consider doing my "homework" again. I've done it and lived it.

Jason also wrote:
"...and please stop expecting that people must do things to please you."

Obviously, you don't know me... as I'm NEVER expecting anyone on this planet and in this galaxy and in all the galaxies to ever "please" me. I'm a very hard man to please, but pleasing others is what I'm used to doing since I am a GIVER (and a Scorpio) and I am loyal to my friends and family- and even nice to my enemies if and when I have them.

I'm not in it for "me", and if you have that line of thinking, then- you're just as bad as the ones that are thinking that it's all about "them". It's not. It's what YOU can give to OTHERS, not for what is there for the taking. Get real.

Jason also wrote:
"And Welcome to Fucking Soak.

*HUGS*"

Hugs back atcha!

Quotes are fun.

[quote]TribalMutt wrote:

QUOTE:
Jason wrote:
"This is a Burning Man event not a utopia."

That has been understood a long time ago, but some just don't get it. I agree with you.

Actually you don't agree with me. You from your first response and I quote- "There was no... "Hi, welcome to SOAK. In case you're thinking of camping here, this is a registered theme camp area, so you'll have to camp outside the ribboned area."

This is their right to feel that way towards you. There is no obligation to be kind and nice. Your internalization of someones reaction is your issue not theirs.

QUOTE:
Jason also wrote:
"It is that simple. Respect different people and their right to be here but they don't have to pretend to like you."

I already do (and did when I was there) and just know that I don't have to pretend to like them either... and that was said rather loudly to make sure that the disrespect did occur.

Then what is your issue? If you don't care why bring it up?

QUOTE:
Jason also wrote:
"Not everyone is touchy feely and believes love is the answer."

Not everyone is self-centered, superficial and standoffish and believe that lashing out at guests is the way to welcome anyone.

Again that is their right to be who they are. If you are really that offended why attend events that draw various types of people not just clones.

QUOTE:
Jason also wrote:
"They have the right to have fun too, even if it means heckling the guy who tries to camp in an area clearly roped off for a reason."

Yeah- this could have been done after the greetings and a joke could have been made of it. That camp obviously had the wrong approach that's for sure.

Great suggestion but again that is their call not yours.

QUOTE:
Jason also wrote:
"As for music, if you want it bring it."

Great! Next time I'll blast it then (or, have it played). :D

Great bring it out. I am sure people who love that music will be right there and those who want other music will be elsewhere. Natural selection at its best.

QUOTE:
Jason also wrote:
"You want more of something bring it."

Great... I'll do that then next year. :D

See you there.

QUOTE:
Jason also wrote:
"Your choice to call one music crap is opening a door for someone to crap on the music you love."

That's understandable and frankly- I don't give a rat's a--. "Rap is Crap" also and I'm going to get a black t-shirt which huge lettering saying something to that effect. We all have our likes and dislikes. I'm just not afraid to keep my hidden, and I do tell it like it is (everything).

And your point is? Again your opinion is like your asshole, it is yours. My asshole is mine like my own opinion. I personally find psy to be pretentious under-produced psuedo spiritual music that shits on a culture it tries to borrow. My opinion as you have yours about other styles (Note that this is bait take it if you so choose or leave it).

QUOTE:
Jason also wrote:
"This event is built by people doing and bringing what they love to share."

Yes- like the Phoenix Festivals. Let's invite everyone and instead of having 18 camps, we'll have 2,293 camps with everyone doing what they want to do in their sacred space/comfort zone. Ridiculous to me, but hey- you suggested it like many of us have before.

Phoenix Fest was a bit different this is a Burning Man event the idea is to participate not be a spectator. This isn't some concert/ music fest. This is not the amazing showcase of mighty djs. It is about you and everyone else who attends. And guess what, that is my opinion. Someone else may see it differently. I personally would rather see 2293 camps and see more original ideas.

QUOTE:
Jason also wrote:
"This event is not about telling other people how to do it better for your enjoyment."

After reading my first post- never did I once mention how others could "do it better". Perhaps that's an subliminal message that people already know that they need to improve it. It's going to happen anyways- because every year should get better, don't you think? I only suggested booking a PsyTrance DJ or whatever, but since you said to "bring it"... that's what we'll do then next year.

Any time you enter the words "should" or "could" it can widely be interpeted as telling people how to do things. Maybe that is just me but really that is what I learned in my writing classes. I am far from a perfect student but I know I retained something.

QUOTE:
Jason also wrote:
"And of course when you pull into the DPW Ghetto expect to get heckled. I am guessing you are fortunate that you didn't get empty beer cans thrown at you. "

They're fortunate that the beer cans and flaming pine cones didn't get thrown back at them as well. Some of us who appear "small" in one's eyes are actually like a Palestinian mustard seed... it becomes much larger and stronger than anyone would ever believe (like something else some of us know). Don't expect nothing will happen if first force is thrown at someone else.

Your choice to act as you may.

QUOTE:
Jason also wrote:
"Do your homework"

Go to Gathering of the Tribes (GOTT), and maybe I'll consider doing my "homework" again. I've done it and lived it.

Actually this is not Gathering of the Tribes. This is Soak and I have done my homework and still sometimes I piss people off. That is life and I will go on. I have contributed in various ways to this event but I am not entitled shit and expect no less. When I say do your homework, I mean to say attend the event and ask how to get involved. Critique is typically not taken well by people who have not have not actually been deep in it.

QUOTE:

QUOTE:
Jason also wrote:
"...and please stop expecting that people must do things to please you."

Obviously, you don't know me... as I'm NEVER expecting anyone on this planet and in this galaxy and in all the galaxies to ever "please" me. I'm a very hard man to please, but pleasing others is what I'm used to doing since I am a GIVER (and a Scorpio) and I am loyal to my friends and family- and even nice to my enemies if and when I have them.

I'm not in it for "me", and if you have that line of thinking, then- you're just as bad as the ones that are thinking that it's all about "them". It's not. It's what YOU can give to OTHERS, not for what is there for the taking. Get real.

Good for you, go on giving your advice. I'll take mine elsewhere.

QUOTE:
Jason also wrote:
"And Welcome to Fucking Soak.

*HUGS*"

Hugs back atcha! :D

EndQuoteGame.

Have fun with your quoted response please take the time to at least respond one last word. I feel I have spoken my piece and I stand behind my words.

QUOTE:
Actually you don't agree with me. You from your first response and I quote- "There was no... "Hi, welcome to SOAK. In case you're thinking of camping here, this is a registered theme camp area, so you'll have to camp outside the ribboned area."

You're telling me what I am doing and not doing? Wow... that's not very smart. I'm obviously agreeing with you, but you're lashing out. If you want to start a flame war- I'm more than welcome to argue with you in person. However, I'm at the age where I don't want or need that anymore. As anyone and everyone can see- my first post was respectful and truthful and wasn't as harsh as you made it out to be.

QUOTE:
This is their right to feel that way towards you. There is no obligation to be kind and nice. Your internalization of someones reaction is your issue not theirs.

Perception is everything. NO ONE in the history of customer service should EVER treat their customers or guests badly. Maybe you'll get that someday. But, I have patience with people like you. You'll get it someday.

QUOTE:
Then what is your issue? If you don't care why bring it up?

I ONLY care about the organization team to see this kind of crappy behavior. It's the same kind of behavior that you're throwing on this message board by attacking me. So, lay the hell off. I'm not attacking anyone so please... in a nice way-- back off!

QUOTE:
Again that is their right to be who they are. If you are really that offended why attend events that draw various types of people not just clones.

Amusement for one. Also, sometimes I have the tendency to shed my love on them and they do the same with me, and they will see their own actions and when it is time for them to change (as we cannot change others), they will on their own... but we can be a good influence on them while supporting them and making a new friend.

".... Ease your mind and make a new friend..." ("From Within" / MBS)

QUOTE:
Great suggestion but again that is their call not yours.

Exactly... but I have the right to suggest anything and everything if I feel like it. What they do or don't do- is up to them. But, I do have the right to say whatever the hell I want as long as others know that this behavior did exist. If people are so drawn not to say anything, then perhaps they don't have the backbone or want to start any flame wars. It's not my intention to start anything, but I will ALWAYS speak the truth... no matter if it hurts or if someone is offended or not (even though I never mean to offend). I will speak the truth... always!

QUOTE:
Great bring it out. I am sure people who love that music will be right there and those who want other music will be elsewhere. Natural selection at its best.

Actually- I thought the one camper stage (where they played Shpongle) was interesting. It reminded me of Chicken Head in some ways. I even danced to the other main DJ the Saturday night. There were good and great beats, and then, there were not so great beats (too Housey). I love Progressive Tribal House, but that's about as Housey as I can get.

QUOTE:
And your point is? Again your opinion is like your asshole, it is yours. My asshole is mine like my own opinion. I personally find psy to be pretentious under-produced psuedo spiritual music that shits on a culture it tries to borrow. My opinion as you have yours about other styles (Note that this is bait take it if you so choose or leave it).

I completely understand. I'm actually MORE into the World Music - organic type of instruments such as djembes, didges, flutes, violins, and nothing electronic. However, my friend plays all that, re-records his own music and mixes it in while he plays the tabla... so, about 85% of the music he is mixing is his own. Everyone has their "cup of tea". No worries here.

QUOTE:
Phoenix Fest was a bit different this is a Burning Man event the idea is to participate not be a spectator.

We did participate and were part of it and were not spectators... but, I know what you mean- because a lot of people did come. However, we had 18 camps at one point and then they said that there too many. I guess it's just a matter of who gets their camp first, registers, etc. No worries.

QUOTE:
This isn't some concert/ music fest. This is not the amazing showcase of mighty djs. It is about you and everyone else who attends. And guess what, that is my opinion. Someone else may see it differently. I personally would rather see 2293 camps and see more original ideas.

I personally would rather see a limited number of camps based off the size of the land... with different types of them camps and a deadline for registering your camp. It would still be like many other events I've been to. If no one has a camp, they can STILL participate in their own theme of how they dress, act, their passion, their art (perhaps display it somewhere where there's not a camp), or whatever. Be free and live I say.

QUOTE:
Any time you enter the words "should" or "could" it can widely be interpeted as telling people how to do things. Maybe that is just me but really that is what I learned in my writing classes. I am far from a perfect student but I know I retained something.

I've also had writing classes too and have been a poet since I was 8 and work as an Administrative Assistant with a sales and marketing background (in which I have over 17 years experience), but unfortunately- I'm unemployed now. People interpret emails and writings differently because of how their own brain (their asshole / their opinion, etc.) processes it. I believe in the "Seek to understand" rule and some people follow it, some don't. I'm ok with those that choose either way, but less for those that argue the fact after they haven't tried to understand in the beginning.

QUOTE:
Your choice to act as you may.

Ok... don't blame the disabled. Long story. But, enough said on that.

[quote]Actually this is not Gathering of the Tribes. This is Soak and I have done my homework and still sometimes I piss people off."

Oh really. I couldn't tell. lol :D That's ok. We all get pissed off once in awhile and some of us (like myself) piss others off also. I don't mean to, I just hope for the best- that's all.

QUOTE:
That is life and I will go on. I have contributed in various ways to this event but I am not entitled shit and expect no less.

Well, my friend and I thought the event was good, just not great. We're not asking for our money back or anything like that, because we ARE trying our best to be "optimistic" and see the "good" things that we took from it... and that was new friendships that we did make. So, we enjoyed ourselves to make it a joke (and to us it was, and to others- it may have not been), but in light of the situation- that's all we can do. :)

QUOTE:
When I say do your homework, I mean to say attend the event and ask how to get involved. Critique is typically not taken well by people who have not have not actually been deep in it.

I have been involved in a lot of events... even for BM '01. I would love to participate and be involved because I do have a lot to offer and basically- I've worked for free to throw events for people and co-promoted and set up, lifted generators, speakers, built structures, whatever... and to me- it's probably more pleasing and rewarding to be a part of something that I can provide for other people without looking for what is in return.

QUOTE:
Good for you, go on giving your advice. I'll take mine elsewhere.

I don't consider it "advice" or even a suggestion- even though I suggested booking Gorilla Dust. :) But, it's like you said- an opinion... even though what happened to us was a fact... I did let it be known. I'm not expecting anyone to be someone they're not or don't want to be. But, if anyone starts anything with anyone- they can surely expect (most of the time) retaliation in some way- whether it's verbally, physically in some cases, or whatever. I'm sure I could go on each thread and post something that I don't agree with. I don't care about that... so, if it's something that I want to follow- or something that will help us, I'm more inclined to post something in which I think is important- like what I posted here.

QUOTE:
EndQuoteGame.

Have fun with your quoted response please take the time to at least respond one last word. I feel I have spoken my piece and I stand behind my words.

And, I stand behind my words as well.

Perhaps if we meet... I could smoke you out and throw you a bottle of wine (or sake)- that is, if you drink. :)

I need a drink now... plus a huge spliffy!

Peace out.

"I personally find psy to be pretentious under-produced psuedo spiritual music that shits on a culture it tries to borrow. My opinion as you have yours about other styles (Note that this is bait take it if you so choose or leave it)."

*tee-hee*

"I'll take your psy and raise you by twelve beats per minute..." ~Joe Gabber~